More than 40 days have passed since the death of Mahsa Amini in Iran, and the protests are not abating. Despite repression and police brutality, more and more people are on the streets. If his parents had not fled from Iran to Norway in the 70s, 40-year-old Masud Gharahkhani – today the vice president of the Norwegian parliament – would have been on the street. In an interview in Točka, he explained the roots and reform force of the mass protests in Iran, but he also spoke about the position in which Norway found itself in the energy crisis as the largest European gas exporter.
The reason for your visit to Zagreb is the International Crimean Platform. From your perspective, what is the importance of this meeting?
First of all, I want to thank Croatia for organizing this meeting. The Crimean platform was launched before the war in Ukraine, but what happened in Crimea was a strong warning of what we are witnessing now. It is about expressing solidarity with the Ukrainian people regarding their struggle for independence, sovereignty, freedom and democracy. We also want to send a clear message. More than 50 countries gathered in Zagreb, we want to say that Crimea is Ukraine, as well as the four illegally annexed regions of Ukraine.
The war has been going on for some time, many predicted that it would not last that long, that it might end faster, but the reality is that the Ukrainian people have been suffering for a long time, and the EU is trying to show support and provide help. How strong do you think European unity is at the moment? We know that challenges from Russia and energy security are becoming an increasing burden for European citizens.
I took up my duties in November. There will be a time before and after the war in Ukraine. What is happening in Ukraine is terrible, but it is good to see that Europe is united in supporting Ukraine. We send weapons, humanitarian aid. We have to make sure that Ukraine wins that war. But why? Because it is about the future of Europe and the values on which we want Europe to be built, namely freedom and democracy. I see that Europe and NATO are united, which is important, and the Crimean platform is also a clear message about that.
So you think that a military solution must be the first condition for ending the war?
It is important to make sure that Ukraine can fight back. Russia thought they would win the war after a few weeks. But the Ukrainian people showed great resilience and courage. I visited Ukraine on May 8, it was difficult to see mass graves in Bucha and bombed cities. But I also saw people who are resisting, but need help, and I am glad that Norway, the EU and NATO are providing weapons, but also humanitarian aid, which is very important, especially because we are entering the winter season.
You said that Russia thought it would be much easier to get into Kyiv, and during all these months of war we have seen Putin and his regime change priorities and back down… Do you think that at this point Russia is really as isolated as we think or does it have hidden allies in Europe?
Russia thought it could divide Europe. They did not divide it, Europe is united and helps Ukraine, which also applies to NATO, and I think that is very important.
So you don’t think there are any political figures on the European continent who would be interested in showing increasing support for Putin?
The people I meet with, my European colleagues, all have a clear message like me: that we have to make sure that Ukraine wins this war, I think that’s important. Of course, a vote was held in the UN General Assembly and most countries condemned what Russia is doing, which is also a clear message, not only from Europe but also from most countries of the world.
Also, with winter approaching, many analysts think Putin’s strategy will be to further divide Europe by cutting off gas and playing the energy policy card. Do you think that the EU’s response is strong enough in this sense?
Yes, because Europe must work together to solve the energy crisis. Norway is now the largest supplier of gas to Europe. We increased gas production by 10%. We also help Ukraine, Norway buys gas for Ukraine for two billion Norwegian kroner to make sure they have heating during the winter. So, we have to solve the problems together. Of course, we must help Ukraine, but also deal with energy independence and the crisis in Europe together.
It is a long-term process, it is not easy to get rid of the dependence of some European countries on Russian gas. Do you think that in this sense all players and stakeholders show enough strength and will to move in that direction?
You know, two weeks ago I visited Germany, Norway allowed them to fill their gas tanks for the winter. But all countries also know that we must invest in renewable energy sources and we must cooperate in order to solve the energy crisis in the long term. I think it will be an important topic for the EU, and Norway will be part of those talks.
Do you think it is possible for Putin to play that card and cut off gas from Russia this winter?
It is difficult for me to make such predictions, but the important thing is that Norway will try to provide as much as it can to help European countries.
And in terms of security issues for your country and countries in your region… What are the biggest security concerns when we talk about Russia and its foreign policy?
First of all, what is happening in Ukraine has changed the security policy for the whole of Europe, so we are also part of it. It is important to say that there is no immediate military threat to Norway, but, of course, we are keeping a close eye on everything, so our oil and gas stations are under a higher level of security. This is part of our contribution to the EU’s efforts to make sure that Ukraine wins this war.
Has it always been part of Norway’s security policy to keep one eye on what is happening in Russia?
We have been a member of NATO for many years. Of course, we in Norway are the eyes and ears of NATO in the north. The joining of Finland and Sweden to NATO will be good for NATO, but also for Nordic cooperation.
The situation is now that additional funds are pouring into your country due to increased gas production and trade. Is there unity within the country on how to spend these funds?
First of all, I understand your question. Norway is not a selfish country. One of the government’s proposals for the budget is to give about 40 billion crowns in aid, which is about four billion euros. At the same time, we are giving 10 billion crowns, one billion euros, of direct aid in the form of various forms of support to Ukraine. And as I said, we have increased gas production to help European countries, and our government is talking with the EU to solve the energy crisis together. I think that is a very important message coming from Norway.
So the idea is to use those additional funds for investments or share them directly with Ukraine?
Yes, that is one of the government’s budget proposals. We also accept a large number of refugees, so we have to increase the budget for local government, but at the same time we support Ukraine, which is an important message. But now the budget needs to go through the parliamentary procedure, and we have to hold a vote on it by December.
PROTESTS IN IRAN
Mr. Gharahkhani, we would also like to talk to you about the situation in Iran, because of your Iranian background and the fact that you are very vocal about what is happening there. I think that what happened on September 16 in a way changed the focus of the world and internationalized the situation in Iran, which some were aware of and some were not. What message can you send to Iranians who continue to protest?
In 1987, my parents made a decision and left the country where I was born, Iran. If they hadn’t done that, I would probably be one of those young people on the streets all over Iran fighting for the same freedom and democracy that I, thankfully, enjoy in my current home country of Norway. Therefore, my important message, and it will be an important message for the future, is that we must support those young people who are fighting for the same values that we have in Europe today.
Do we have a clear picture of what is happening there? We know about restrictions in the media, restrictions on free access to the Internet, but some voices still broke through, we see strikes, student protests… Can you share with us a better picture of the current situation?
At the beginning, people thought that these protests would stop. But for the first time we are seeing mass demonstrations in all parts of Iran that have now been going on for almost a month. The authorities tried to shut down the internet, but young people are smart, they found different ways to show what’s going on. At the moment, people are being killed, beaten, and I think it is very important that the international community supports them. I am very glad that the EU has started to introduce various sanctions.
And these protests took on an international character. You mentioned that leaders are young people who invent various ways… We are witnessing protests in front of embassies around the world.
That’s right. A few days ago, 80,000 people showed up in Berlin to be their voice for freedom and democracy, which is good and important.
A protest was also held here in Zagreb two or three weeks ago, the Iranian community living here came out to protest. According to your knowledge, what is the current situation in Iran regarding freedom of speech and human rights? I know this is a bit of a general question, but can you share some insights with us?
Well, in the middle is a country where there is no freedom of speech, no democracy and no freedom. In 1979, when my parents achieved the revolution in Iran, they wanted freedom and democracy and for the huge oil profits to be invested in building a social system. That didn’t happen, the elite keep all the money and they enjoy freedom. But ordinary people in Iran have no freedom and that is what they are fighting for. As a journalist in Iran, if you write something that the authorities don’t like, you will end up in jail. Young people are fighting for a little more democracy and freedom, so that women can decide whether or not they want to wear the hijab. These young people are now being beaten, so they need to be given solidarity and support.
Has there even been a real investigation into the death of Mahsa Amini, the murder of the girl that led to these protests?
You know, Mahsa Amini is a symbol of what has been happening in Iran for more than 40 years. We have seen many like Mahsa Amini. Amnesty International reported that more than 23 children were killed in the protests. So, people are on the streets, fighting, beating them, shooting at some… It is important that the international community is aware of this and sends a message that this is unacceptable.
Do you perhaps have clearer information about how many people lost their lives in total during the protests?
There are different reports, they say that more than 200 people were killed, but it is difficult to get accurate information, and many were imprisoned.
We have seen that you may not be a target yourself, but the Iranian authorities have singled you out… We have seen the headlines that they will sue those they think are helping the protesters, even the media. The BBC tried to give space to the voices of these people in Iran. Does that worry you personally?
I’m not worried about myself. I feel an obligation to use my voice to be their voice. That’s why I made that video immediately when I got the picture of Mahsa Amini in the hospital after she was beaten. I recorded the video in Farsi. I knew what I had done, but I didn’t know that millions of people would watch it. It’s the social media world we live in. The fact that the Iranian regime designated me as a target – I don’t care about that! I want to give young people a voice, which is important, and many others do.
Is this the most important protest in Iran that you remember and do you see the situation resolving or developing in a certain direction?
This is the first time that protests have lasted more than four weeks, but not only in some but in all parts of Iran. This shows that the majority of Iranians are under 30 years old, they are the children of that revolution, this generation. Many of the messages I receive say that change is needed now and that they are ready to die for a little more freedom and democracy. This shows the current feeling among many Iranians. And that is why we are witnessing mass protests across Iran.
And to conclude and connect these two topics, if possible… We have seen and heard from you what the internal situation is, and what is your position on Iranian politics globally? How involved are they in the war in Ukraine?
Well, the drones that the Russians use are known to come from Iran. So, in many ways, they are also part of the current war. I think what is important is what the EU is doing at the moment in terms of sanctions and that there is an awareness of Iran’s position in many parts of the world.
We started the conversation with a question about Russia’s possible allies around the world and their possible connections. Do you see a stronger connection between Russia and Iran in the future?
Of course. Putin and the Ayatollah are each other’s biggest supporters.
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